So, I had to seriously focus to read this as it is some dense damn writing. that said, I am really into christian theology as I had to break my faith down from the inside to really figure out what my beliefs were.
This is a very interesting dilemma you posit. And the process of your thought makes me think we have some similar conclusions about, shall we say, the "spirit" of the Bible and its teachings.
I agree wholeheartedly that evolution and God can easily co-exist. The message of evolution is simply that things are constantly changing. However it started, God could still have been there. And in general, I tend to take the view of the architect god that set some wheels in motion and then sat back to watch what we would make of ourselves.
For me, the big turning point in my faith was understanding the council of Nicene and the filioque controversy. When I realized that a group of guys in 300 AD voted on which books were in the Bible, it helped me understand that some of those books were just written by some dudes and said some good things. More specifically, I now think of Paul as the Dear Abby of the NT. Sure, he gives some good advice, but I don't think he's divinely inspired beyond trying really hard to do the right thing. This relieved a lot of pressure I felt from Paul's views on sex, which definitely are hellenistic in the mind/matter area.
If you're not familiar with the filioque controversy of the same era, it's pretty much the argument of whether the holy spirit proceeds from the father or from the father AND the son. That latter of which limits gods ability to act in this world to the name of Jesus. While I can believe that Jesus is a bridge to a relationship with god, I can't believe that god is powerless outside of christ. I mean, maybe the advent of christ is the reason we as people no longer need miracles, but I can't believe that a god of love is ignoring anything not deeded over to him through Jesus.
Anyway, more to point, I am no longer sure how to define that spark that makes us alive. I totally get the issues you're illustrating above, and I think it's interesting how a soul can be used to negate the need for god. Personally, I think all those words are clumsy ways to say "self". There is something in this bag of meat that gives us thought and teh idea of self. I realized in my biology course that whatever this self was and however it worked after death, I was sure that self was bound to this world. And if that is the case, than we already know that nothing in this world actually goes away, it just changes. So whatever my "self" my experience of life actually is, it will always be a part of this world. Now, I'm not saying I'll be consciously aware of it. But it has made me question the idea of reincarnation and what happens to that spark of life. I doubt it leaves. I bet it does somehow incorporate into the world around us. Will I "experience"it? Who knows. However you put the actual definition of such things, my goal is to protect the flame in the vessel and to let it burn as brightly and fiercely as I can let it while i contain it in this life.
Amazing how hard it is to really dig into some of these ideas, innit?
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Date: 2009-03-11 04:47 pm (UTC)This is a very interesting dilemma you posit. And the process of your thought makes me think we have some similar conclusions about, shall we say, the "spirit" of the Bible and its teachings.
I agree wholeheartedly that evolution and God can easily co-exist. The message of evolution is simply that things are constantly changing. However it started, God could still have been there. And in general, I tend to take the view of the architect god that set some wheels in motion and then sat back to watch what we would make of ourselves.
For me, the big turning point in my faith was understanding the council of Nicene and the filioque controversy. When I realized that a group of guys in 300 AD voted on which books were in the Bible, it helped me understand that some of those books were just written by some dudes and said some good things. More specifically, I now think of Paul as the Dear Abby of the NT. Sure, he gives some good advice, but I don't think he's divinely inspired beyond trying really hard to do the right thing. This relieved a lot of pressure I felt from Paul's views on sex, which definitely are hellenistic in the mind/matter area.
If you're not familiar with the filioque controversy of the same era, it's pretty much the argument of whether the holy spirit proceeds from the father or from the father AND the son. That latter of which limits gods ability to act in this world to the name of Jesus. While I can believe that Jesus is a bridge to a relationship with god, I can't believe that god is powerless outside of christ. I mean, maybe the advent of christ is the reason we as people no longer need miracles, but I can't believe that a god of love is ignoring anything not deeded over to him through Jesus.
Anyway, more to point, I am no longer sure how to define that spark that makes us alive. I totally get the issues you're illustrating above, and I think it's interesting how a soul can be used to negate the need for god. Personally, I think all those words are clumsy ways to say "self". There is something in this bag of meat that gives us thought and teh idea of self. I realized in my biology course that whatever this self was and however it worked after death, I was sure that self was bound to this world. And if that is the case, than we already know that nothing in this world actually goes away, it just changes. So whatever my "self" my experience of life actually is, it will always be a part of this world. Now, I'm not saying I'll be consciously aware of it. But it has made me question the idea of reincarnation and what happens to that spark of life. I doubt it leaves. I bet it does somehow incorporate into the world around us. Will I "experience"it? Who knows. However you put the actual definition of such things, my goal is to protect the flame in the vessel and to let it burn as brightly and fiercely as I can let it while i contain it in this life.
Amazing how hard it is to really dig into some of these ideas, innit?